Proper updating procedure?

[rhylin]

Ok, from updating in the past, I read to patch without externals because it could interfere with what Mazzle has done already.

Do we now patch WITH externals? or continue doing so without?

I've got the 1.1 patch 1 installed, and before a possible catastrophy occurs, I'd like to be 100% sure I'm going to be doing it right.

[fyrye]

Originally Posted by rhylin Ok, from updating in the past, I read to patch without externals because it could interfere with what Mazzle has done already. Do we now patch WITH externals? or continue doing so without? I've got the 1.1 patch 1 installed, and before a possible catastrophy occurs, I'd like to be 100% sure I'm going to be doing it right.

I update with WAU with the following settings.
Preferences, Download Dependencies, Delete before updating, use recyclebin.
Then I Update/Install WITH Externals.

General Update I do not delete before updating, and occassionally I will skip version check as some devs do not change the version numbers after a minor update.

[Trevelyen]

DONT follow that, it will bloat your addons folder to rather large proportions. How ever it WILL work, but why take up the extra space?

GREAT instructions can be found Here thanks to Meio.

-- Trevelyen

[fyrye]

it will work and have all necessary files for the addon/s to run properly.
WAU will bloat your addons folder with LIBS that range from around 300kbs-2.5mbs if you update WITH externals, if you dont, you miss library updates that causes errors.

If you would like to trim down the size and merge all the needed LIBS to one folder that will work better as that is how mazzle does it.
Default Mazzle After Update WITHOUT Externals: 69.8MBS
After Update WITH Externals and dependancies: 118MBS

Bloated yes, but with the 3.29gbs already used by WoW, i dont think 48.2mbs is going to slow you down any.

If there are still any questions, here is the post from WAU, to clarify that it will not slow down WoW performance, just initial load as it sorts through the libs.

WITH Externals AddonA uses libraryX and LibraryY, and AddonB also uses the same two libraries. If you installed both AddonA and AddonB "With Externals", you would have a folder structure as follows: Interface\AddOns ..AddonA ....Libs ......LibraryX ......LibraryY ..AddonB ....Libs ......LibraryX ......LibraryY When you load AddonA and AddonB, each addon instructs WoW to load the libraries contained within it's folder structure, meaning LibraryX and LibraryY both get loaded twice (once for each addon). X and Y are smart enough to know that they are the same library so only one copy remains in memory. This is also called "embedding libraries". [edit]WITHOUT Externals Using the example above, but installed "Without Externals", the folder structure would instead be as follows: Interface\AddOns ..AddonA ..AddonB ..LibraryX ..LibraryY AddonA and AddonB will have instructions in their TOC file to force WoW to load LibraryX and LibraryY first before attempting to load either addon (specifically, A and B will list LibraryX and LibraryY as dependencies). This means you only load each library once, shortening the loading time when first logging in. This is also called "disembedding libraries". To run without externals, enable "Automatic Dependency Download" and disable "Default mode WITH externals". [edit]Which is better? No matter which way you install your addons, memory usage and performance is (usually) not affected, only the initial loading time. Library upgrades should always be backwards compatible within the same major version. Of course, some people don't like seeing 40 different libraries in their addon folders as "individual addons". The main issue most people have with this is that there is no standard library naming scheme so there are heaps of libraries in your addon folder without any easy way to differentiate the libraries from the actual addons. Library authors are moving towards naming their Libraries starting with Lib- though, so this shouldn't be too much of an issue in the future. But the future is a long way off. If hard drive space is an issue (like if you have *every* Ace addon installed and a dinky little hard drive), you may want to update without externals. That way you don't have 974 copies of the exact same files all over your Addons folder.

[Seerah]

Read this: http://www.wowace.com/forums/index.php?topic=8542.0

You don't need to update WITH externals *and* use automatic dependency download. You end up with libs in both places. You need to pick which way you want to run. Either use automatic dependency download and update WITHOUT externals or don't use it and update WITH.

occassionally I will skip version check as some devs do not change the version numbers after a minor update

I don't think you know how the svn and WAU work. Every time a new version of an addon is checked into the svn, the svn assigns it a new revision number (rXXXXX). When you download that addon, the svn zips it up along with the required libraries (if you're using WITH externals or downloading straight from the files page). Every time a library is updated that that addon uses, a new zip file is created for you to download, which is given a minor revision number (rXXXXX.xx where .xx is the number of times the addon has been repackaged with its libs, or number of times the libs have been updated - whichever makes more sense to you).

So... devs don't control the version numbers. Any minor revision (.xx) is when the library is updated, and not the addon itself. If you update WITH externals, WAU sees the new minor revision (.xx) number and downloads the new version for you. If you update WITHOUT externals and use standalone libraries, WAU sees the new version of the library and updates it for you just like any other addon. You should never need to use "skip version check" unless you are reinstalling all addons (but, actually, there's a command for that in WAU now, too).

[fyrye]

Originally Posted by Seerah Read this: http://www.wowace.com/forums/index.php?topic=8542.0 You don't need to update WITH externals *and* use automatic dependency download. You end up with libs in both places. You need to pick which way you want to run. Either use automatic dependency download and update WITHOUT externals or don't use it and update WITH. I don't think you know how the svn and WAU work. Every time a new version of an addon is checked into the svn, the svn assigns it a new revision number (rXXXXX). When you download that addon, the svn zips it up along with the required libraries (if you're using WITH externals or downloading straight from the files page). Every time a library is updated that that addon uses, a new zip file is created for you to download, which is given a minor revision number (rXXXXX.xx where .xx is the number of times the addon has been repackaged with its libs, or number of times the libs have been updated - whichever makes more sense to you). So... devs don't control the version numbers. Any minor revision (.xx) is when the library is updated, and not the addon itself. If you update WITH externals, WAU sees the new minor revision (.xx) number and downloads the new version for you. If you update WITHOUT externals and use standalone libraries, WAU sees the new version of the library and updates it for you just like any other addon. You should never need to use "skip version check" unless you are reinstalling all addons (but, actually, there's a command for that in WAU now, too).

Yes thats what i was referring to as occasionally skipping it, (in his case to re-download everything)
In the update software I ran previously any updates made to the version number in the script was checked upon compression, and the zip was renamed as such, so i assumed the same here.
With Automatic dependencies checked, it downloads any other needed addons, such as Fubr for Fubar_moneyFu if you didn't select it

Adding Dependency FuBar_AmmoFu -> FuBar

While having dependacies unchecked and Install/Updating WITH Externals will not download fubar but will install the library files for it.

Though I am unsure how you mean in both places. I do know I receive errors If I update WITHOUT externals and have Download Dependencies checked.

From the standpoint of someone who may not be familiar with file hierarchy, scripting, and just wants to play with out errors, my method is close to fool proof.

They see a new shiny addon they think they might like, dont have the library files for, and it requires another addon to work, Download Dependacies, Update WITH Externals, Delete Old, and Skip Version check.

[meio]

Another thing to keep in mind is that if you update with externals you will experience a slower load time in WoW. The in-game memory usage will be the same either way, it just takes a longer time to load everything with externals. I left a couple of the mods with externals in the first patch just to get it out faster. In the next patch the time will be taken to externalize all of the dependencies so that the load times are not as bad.

[Banalina902]

Thanks for explaining what the heck I should be doing when using WAU. I've used both ways when updating or downloading new addons. My question is: since I've gotten a bloated addon folder and experience long load times as mentioned above, how should I deal with this? Get rid of duplicate copies, etc.

[fyrye]

Though I highly suggest against going this route,
http://www.wowace.com/forums/index.php?topic=8542.0

follow the instructions to install the standalone libraries.

UNCHECK delete before extracting (NOTE: you may leave this checked if you wish to always do clean installs of your addons)
Will actually be: Delete before Updating.

Originally Posted by Seerah Only use standalone libs if you... * are a developer who wishes to control the versions of your libraries * wish to have more control over your libraries for debugging * need to minimize the file size of your Interface folder * want to minimize initial loading times (NOTE: any decrease in loading times will be minimal, if noticeable at all, and only effects loading when first entering the game or reloading your ui) * want to see an accurate representation of the memory usage of each individual addon and library (NOTE: when libs are embedded, the library's memory usage is counted as part of the addon that houses it. ie, ArkInventory may say that it uses 8MB of memory, when, actually, 7MB of that belongs to the libs inside and any work they are doing for both AI and any other addons that use those libs)

[Seerah]

As I said above, you need to do one or the other, you shouldn't have libs *both* embedded and standalone. Mazzle already uses standalone libs. Stick with it.